wake_up_bomb wrote:
I don't disagree with what your'e saying about Islam, Andy, but I think it's wrong to assume that all Muslims are extremists, which I feel is the implication here. There are lots of moderate Muslims who wouldn't do anything to hurt anyone. Of course, I still disagree with some of their beliefs, but I disagree with most people's beliefs.
I also just think it is particularly hypocritical of these people to be so critical of the 'Muslim world', but yet we hear absolutely no critique of the British establishment from them. I've heard none of them - with the possible exception of Ian McEwan - saying anything about drone bombing, or something like workfare even. Christopher Hitchens managed to give lengthy critiques of the 'War on Terror' without ever mentioning that the United States has a 'defence' budget in excess of $1 trillion, instead pontificating that it is some sort of moral crusade.
My view is that although I disagree with many of the things that go on in Islamic nations, it is up to the people of those nations to rise up, end those practices, and change their society if they wish to do so. I also strongly believe that the assertion which is often made that Islam wants to take over the world is misleading. Yes, there is some suggestion that 'non-believers' should be converted, but I believe that if these countries were left alone to their own devices, which they should be, we would never hear anything from them at all.
Not all, but certainly most.
You'll find most muslims are quite happy with sharia law etc, its certainly surprising to us that so many would find it acceptable but what we have to bear in mind is whats normal for those people and what they were like not long ago before we arrived to get the oil out.
They will happily abuse women and children and most support it, you have to come to grips with it tbh.
Christianity was basically identical around the middle ages..roughly matching the islamic calendar
Our real enemy here as anyone with intelligence can see is the oil industry. They dominate huge aspects of everyones lives, without the oil industry there would be no concern, indeed not only would there be less concern about terrorism but less about pollution or chemicals or big agri corp and on and on it goes.
The ONLY way this problem will ever get resolved is to simply abandon them but we won't because the real interests in all this and therefore the real terrorists are at the top of our corporate, governing and banking systems. They are filthy stinking rich because of the situation we are in today, its really really obvious and nothings going to change so long as the current status quo remains.
The profit motive dictates the way things are and theres no incentive as yet for alternate energy because theres no profit to be had from it.
The alternate energy and tech IS there, sat there...literally terawatts of power anytime we choose to implement it.
I would like to see more criticism by these people like Dawkins of the western mindset but when all said and done as I mentioned before, he's profiting from what he does and its harder to sell criticism of our own mindset than it is to sell criticism of islam. I need only point at DIF or the daily mail to make that much self evident
I have always tried to make sure I equally gripe about all religion (including statism and the monetary system) as these really are all about a dogma, a belief set, it only exists in peoples minds, it actually has no relevance to the real universe, the laws of physics and nature etc.
Its about time we realised we're long past superstition now, we have real factual evidence about things now that in the past would have seemed like magic and lay people would resort to religion to explain it. Certainly westerners should all be capable of rational thought now but the fear of those in conservative establishment remains, it almost seems like a panic now IMHO.
If people start to realise that there is a way to live their lives productively without having to compete with each other then their way of elite luxury is at risk, they are set for a tumble, no longer will they be revered and held on a pedestal above all others, they'll just become common people like everyone else...thats probably the one thing that scares the crap out of them IMHO. Its like a fall from grace.
Anyone who talks about such a way of life where there is little or no pollution, any job anyone wants , any training anyone wants, open publication of all information, travel wherever you like, no borders, no wars is frowned upon as apostasy and apostasy btw is a head chopping offence in riyadh.
