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Poll: Santa's sack

It's ok Bar 6 50%
It's not ok Bar 6 50%
Total number of voters: 12 ( dubmeup, entrangermercenary1, oioioi, angelchemuel, chandrakavi ) See more
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TOPIC: Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa?

Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 02:02 #81

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Gilly wrote:
Why can't you get it?

Sean's intention behind prying in my private messages were never good to start with - his motivation was malice. Telling tiny tots that Father Christms is real is motivated by the opposite, and also done in the knowledge that when they're a bit older, they'll know it was just a game.

Sean's 'justification' was purely a lame attempt to blacken my character in the hope that it would deflect from his twattishness.

Again, I don't see those 2 scenarios as being akin in any way, shape or form.

Maybe it is your explanation.

As far as I can see, you advocate self justification when you are doing the lying and draw the line when you are being lied to.

I have also yet to see a logical explanation of how lying to children about Santa is a loving act.
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 03:23 #82

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you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 03:37 #83

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angelchemuel wrote:
you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

:jane:

And why do you think that I, or Reptired for that matter, "need" to do such a thing?
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 05:02 #84

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If the contention is that children are mentally scarred as a result of the santa game then I say that belief is evidence of a lack of contact and understanding of children. Kids are really quite tough and resilient.

Like it or not, children are not born fully cognizant, self-sufficient and independent critters.
They require protection and guidance to increase their chances of survival. Mythological entities can be useful analogous allies on that mission.
They are simply tools.

Life is full of deception and contradictions, not to prepare a child for these is dangerous and negligent.

Sean?
A morality reference point?
PMGate?
AGAIN!!!!?
Never mind Santa doing fuckers mental injury, it appears to me that a huge number of DIF users would have been less mentally and emotionally broken by some penny-ante, jumped up, plastic, wannabee internet cult priest and snake-oil salesman, if their parents had better prepared them. It's dire to witness.
Get over the dick already.
No really, do it! :roll:
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 06:22 #85

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Space Bandit wrote:
Not had a poll for a while so let's have one!

I've not got kids, (for now thank fuck) but if I did there'd be no lying about this shit, or anything else.
Or isn't it that simple? :D

1474397 203545589833044 2110301153 N

Another boring tree hugging liiberal ffs..poor kids :(
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 06:24 #86

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feather wrote:
If the contention is that children are mentally scarred as a result of the santa game then I say that belief is evidence of a lack of contact and understanding of children. Kids are really quite tough and resilient.

Like it or not, children are not born fully cognizant, self-sufficient and independent critters.
They require protection and guidance to increase their chances of survival. Mythological entities can be useful analogous allies on that mission.
They are simply tools.

Life is full of deception and contradictions, not to prepare a child for these is dangerous and negligent.

Sean?
A morality reference point?
PMGate?
AGAIN!!!!?
Never mind Santa doing fuckers mental injury, it appears to me that a huge number of DIF users would have been less mentally and emotionally broken by some penny-ante, jumped up, plastic, wannabee internet cult priest and snake-oil salesman, if their parents had better prepared them. It's dire to witness.
Get over the dick already.
No really, do it! :roll:

You need some therapy ffs

A thread about father xmas and kids and you manage to bring sean into it :rofl: :rofl:

Did he scar you that much :coffee:
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 07:04 #87

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entrangermercenary1 wrote:
You need some therapy ffs
A thread about father xmas and kids and you manage to bring sean into it :rofl: :rofl:
Did he scar you that much :coffee:
Read it again. I'm the one complaining about Sean being brought into it. :roll:

Try to keep up son, yer sounding a bit wheezy there at the back. :D :gleek:
Last Edit: 21 Dec 2013 07:04 by feather.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 07:10 #88

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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 09:13 #89

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Ok,
When my kids mum went out one night and did something so despicable that i couldnt stay in the relationship and my kids subsequently adked why mum and dad were splitting up, should i have told them the truth? Knowing that it would probably have destroyed their relationship with their mum? Which was a loving one?

I'll answer. 11 years on, the boys still have a perfectly loving relationship with both parents. They are well adjusted and happy.
So lying was the right thing to do. End of. No room for debate...
Anyone suggesting the thing to do was tell them their mum was a fucking whore is bat shit crazy imho.

On the other hand, in order to save face, the boys mum went around telling a lot of big porky pies. My eldest once asked me if i used to hit her......he had heard her telling that lie to a friend...he was genuinely distressed and it took me a long time to help him get over the experience of thinking his dad used to beat his mum. Even though he only had the lie in his head for a few days.....

Anyone getting it yet?
"laws are unenforceable if the majority break them."-humanspirit,
"avoid the concept of an ambassador for truth altogether"-gilly.
Last Edit: 21 Dec 2013 09:20 by dubmeup.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 09:14 #90

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I AM ALL I AM wrote:
angelchemuel wrote:
you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

:jane:

And why do you think that I, or Reptired for that matter, "need" to do such a thing?

Well duuuuhhhh it's self evident you dingbat!
You obviously have no idea how to embrace the world children live in.
As adults, the world would be a better place if we started looking at it through children's eyes........and even accepting their 'invisible' friends.
The world is full of colour......but you are obviously looking at it through monochrome glasses

:jane:
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Last Edit: 21 Dec 2013 09:25 by angelchemuel.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:44 #91

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Gilly wrote:
Reptired wrote:
Gilly wrote:
So say a child wife displeases by defying you and persists in doing things, for example, that are dangerous. If I'm right in thinking you wouldn't use removal of his / her property, or violence to deter them, I'd love to know how you think you'd tackle it. Because you can take my word for it that reasoning & persuasion don't always do the trick. I'd like you to tell me, because it's always people who've never had kids wives who apparently have all the answers as to the right way to raise kids, funnily enough. :D

I think by that point the damage to the relationship may be too great.

You have a responsibility to create a safe environment and in an emergency situation you would physically move the child if it were in danger.

If you think that somebody acting in a way which "displeases by defying you" is an excuse to use violence against them , or steal their property, I would ask you to seek some professional help, especially if you have children.

What rubbish! An environment that a child can't hurt themselves in is a padded cell. Is that where you'd put them? I think you've probably never even met any children from the way you're talking.

But you'd make a great dad. Child's being unco-operative coz is the wrong way out, so you leave them causing mayhem while you seek professional help because you fear you'll damage your relationship if you take control! Let's hope that help arrives lickety split, eh.

Sure, living is a dangerous occupation but you make the environment as safe as possible, if a child burns itself with hot water it's the parents fault, if the parent abuses the child for this , that's also on the parent. There is no justification for abusing your children.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:47 #92

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Gilly wrote:
I think you missed the bit about a padded cell being the only place where a determined nipper can't damage themselves.

And it can be curiosity rather than naughtiness that leads a little un into danger - you might remove them immediately, say if they're trying to investigate your electric sockets. But if they're determined, they'll be back poking pencils in it later when you take your eyes off them. You can't remove them permanently, and you can't remove your sockets, generally speaking, so the solution might be to shout at them, to drive home that they've to leave it alone (assuming, obviously that they're not responded to reason / coaxing). You have to get over the fear of destroying your relationship, and take control. Because, believe it or not, that is the role of a responsible parent.

This is exactly the point, if you lie to your children and abuse them in other ways, how the hell are they going to know what is what, you're an abusive liar and everything is to be distrusted. You have removed reason as a way to interact with the world.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:49 #93

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wake_up_bomb wrote:
You really have to impose your will over a child at some point otherwise it's highly unlikely that they'll survive and even if they do they won't develop language or any social skills.

Please show me some good evidence for this, all the evidence I have seen shows that abuse damages the brain physically, reduces IQ and destroys social skills.
sanctumzone.co.uk/forum/Members-Chat-Are...-santa.html?start=60
Last Edit: 21 Dec 2013 10:49 by Reptired.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:52 #94

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Gilly wrote:

But having said that, you often encounter the type of assertions from those childless people, such as the ones (no offence intended) expressed by Rep, who thinks that if a child is being willful, it's because you have a damaged relationship - and any form of sanctioning is scorned, so professional help is needed. And (honestly, no offence intended :D ) that's just ridiculous.

If a child is "being wilful" it is because it has will, I don't see a problem with this.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:54 #95

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angelchemuel wrote:
you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

:jane:

Would you care to enlighten us?
I don't think handing a child over to some other people at such a young age is a good is a for the child by the way, not a place to meet healthy children.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:56 #96

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knobmeup wrote:
Ok,
When my kids mum went out one night and did something so despicable that i couldnt stay in the relationship and my kids subsequently adked why mum and dad were splitting up, should i have told them the truth? Knowing that it would probably have destroyed their relationship with their mum? Which was a loving one?

I'll answer. 11 years on, the boys still have a perfectly loving relationship with both parents. They are well adjusted and happy.
So lying was the right thing to do. End of. No room for debate...
Anyone suggesting the thing to do was tell them their mum was a fucking whore is bat shit crazy imho.

On the other hand, in order to save face, the boys mum went around telling a lot of big porky pies. My eldest once asked me if i used to hit her......he had heard her telling that lie to a friend...he was genuinely distressed and it took me a long time to help him get over the experience of thinking his dad used to beat his mum. Even though he only had the lie in his head for a few days.....

Anyone getting it yet?

You left the relationship because your wife did something despicable.
What happened to the children?
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 10:59 #97

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Any parent who lies about Santa Claus is as bad as Huntley, Savile and Stalin all rolled into one.

How old are you, child? Seven, you say? Put that Phillip Pullman book down and read some Marx!! Stop living in a dream world and get with some facts. Santa Claus is really Satan because someone on the internet says so. Dumb fuckin tiny person!! Lose the imagination and get real!
Stop pretending you're a car - whizzing around the garden like a cretin.

Nothing is real, existence is brief so start planning for your death, you little fuck.

Stop using your imagination and take the time to be a miserable shit instead.

Jeez, that guy has issues.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 12:09 #98

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Reptired wrote:
Gilly wrote:

But having said that, you often encounter the type of assertions from those childless people, such as the ones (no offence intended) expressed by Rep, who thinks that if a child is being willful, it's because you have a damaged relationship - and any form of sanctioning is scorned, so professional help is needed. And (honestly, no offence intended :D ) that's just ridiculous.

If a child is "being wilful" it is because it has will, I don't see a problem with this.

:D And that's where you'd make as good a parent as the scientists I mentioned on another thread...
Gilly wrote:
Hahaha! Just watched 10 minutes of that nanny programme. It was like watching a car crash.

2 scientists have a 3 yr old & a 1 yr old, and the kids are shrieking and trying to kill each other - dad's going, "No dear, we don't want you to do that", while one's braying the other over the head with a bottle & ignoring him!

They make shows about any old bollix these days.

Of course reasoning is always the proper basis of teaching kids. The problem is, small children are to a great extent focussed on their immediate wants, and don't take distress caused to others much into account sometimes. If you don't 'impose your will', by laying down rules about conduct, and think you're going to get by with reasoning alone with a tired, cranky tot, then you end up like the couple in that programme. They daren't go out in public much with them much, because they scream and demand, and try to run off, and drag products off shop shelves, and ignore mum & dad's attempts at reasoning, and are generally a disruptive pain in the arse to all within earshot.

It's not abuse to make them behave properly, and it does them no favours to avoid doing so. It's basic common sense.

Laissez faire parenting is neglectful. Neglect is abuse. :thumbup:
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Last Edit: 21 Dec 2013 12:29 by Gilly.
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 12:17 #99

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Reptired wrote:
angelchemuel wrote:
you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

:jane:

Would you care to enlighten us?
I don't think handing a child over to some other people at such a young age is a good is a for the child by the way, not a place to meet healthy children.

Why would you think children socialising in a creche would be unhealthy??? :conf:
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Is it OK to lie to your kids about Santa? 21 Dec 2013 12:36 #100

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Reptired wrote:
angelchemuel wrote:
you really need to go play with a creche full of kids and learn to see the world through their eyes.....you should maybe take reptired with you too. You'll find it very enlightening.
Out of the mouths of babes an' all that.

:jane:

Would you care to enlighten us?
I don't think handing a child over to some other people at such a young age is a good is a for the child by the way, not a place to meet healthy children.

Yes I will enlighten you.....the creche analogy was to have you and IAAwhatevA overdosed on young children.
But having had my second brew, I've had a second thought...you two would probably damage and mentally scar them for the rest of their lives!

As you have asked me a question and I have answered it....allow me to ask you and IAAwhatevA one, and show me the same respect and answer it please......
Do you have children?
I am just curious and am not going to pass any comment whatsoever on whether your answer is a yay or a nay..I promise.
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