Bwahaa

I've had a hunt around and tbh its very difficult to get any solid definition of what this actually is.

My own would be:

1) Owns own business, self employed.
2) Makes about US$100,000 - $250,000 in profits per annum. (but static income)
3) Owns own large home (thats at least 2 or 3 acres, 5 or 6 bedrooms+ IMHO) and land with no mortgage outstanding.

I suppose its possible to have employed middle class too but they would have to be earning perhaps $120,000 to hit the same disposable income bracket. Might vary slightly according to tax rates in various countries etc.

Working class is everyone below that amount. Most likely with debt and uncertain job prospects/future.
I put people on $40k as being the same as unemployed because at the end of the day, they're just as screwed. Poverty trap if you will....the 60k to 90k might stand a chance at the middle class bracket if they get lucky and/or have the right connections.

Upper class for me would be people with large tax free sums and investments, offshore accounts, perhaps a yacht in addition to 2 or 3 houses, maybe even renting some off etc. Basically someone who can make money on the back of money with very little personal effort involved.

The 'official' figures (vague though they are) tend to suggest middle class is around $50k which seems quite laughable given that middle class earners are meant to supposedly be property/business owners (at least in historical terms). I don't call being mortgaged up to your eyeballs as being a 'property owner'.

Do the media perhaps wish to lower the target for what is portrayed as middle class to give people the false impression that they are doing well?

What would you say middle class is? over!

I think they're kind of like the working class, but with better jobs and a slightly posher voice

Frog wrote:
lol, it sure as hell doesn't exist for most of us, at least going by the definition I would give it anyways.

Frog wrote:
What frog said. I would add that my grandparents were probably the closest in my immediate family to 'becoming' middle class, probably in the late seventies/early eighties.

It's been fairly steadily downhill from that point for the rest of my family, from what I can see. Remembering my childhood, I'd also say that my parents had a much better standard of living than I currently do, in part due to the success in business that my grandfather had at that time. He had his own business, had previously earned enough on his own salary to purchase his home (imagine trying to do that now) and things were very comfortable indeed, thank you very much. Unfortunately, any assets and fortune 'the family' had at that point have since gone for a burton.

In terms of lifestyle and leisure, I've never had it so shit. So, here I sit on my working-class (but struggling to find any actual work) arse, once again.



I always imagined the 'middle' bit to be some kind of bourgeois construct to keep the plebs away from the actual top-brass. Whilst acting as a barrier, it also gives the lower class something to aspire to in terms of accumulating wealth and possessions (although unlike the upper classes, it seems to be very much a generational thing that doesn't last that long).

wears boden clothes and says 'yah'

dawnbreak wrote: Yes, instantly recognisable at school gate!

Maybe owns a pellet boiler, goat, is a school govener and their children Harry and Emily have cello lessons and do rowing and riding as extracurricular activities. Makes sure kids get into a grammar school so their little darlings don't get flat vowels from mixing with 'common' children.

Middle class income is way lower in the USA than 100,000 dollars a year,probably more like anyone at 40,000 a year is middle income.
Generally speaking

The blue class worker of the 50's and 60's brought home way less than 40,000 a year also,more like 20,000 a year the term middle class means the ability to keep your head above water,possibly have a new car payment without it being a burden,own your home or buying it,and have a steady job.

The USA is not a country anymore with a solid middle class, that feels secure about their future financial security.

I'm sure there are plenty of good peeps in the so called middle class. You can't help who your parents are.

I said "yah" once It was a total accident! It was in Burger King. I think I asked for a Chicken Royale meal, and the girl said it back to me to confirm it, so I just said "yah" all posh and that

i don't know what the fuck happened

Ab Origine wrote:
This is why I see the MSM definition continuously lowering the bar so to speak.
The lower the wage definition (or preferably removal of it altogether) the less likely people will be to take a look at things and say 'hang on a minute...they're fucking me up the ass!' in a bill hicks kinda way lol.

Rick wrote:
Aye, I said middle class not middle income
Hence my definition, you could lower the salary as you turn the clock back but they'd have the same ability etc.

irrepressible wrote:
Posh twat.

There should be a posh twat emoticon

In Britain, I would suggest that you have to own, and I mean own not be under mortgage, property to truly qualify, otherwise you are totally subject to the vagaries of the financial / housing markets, whether you understand this or not, and are as such completely vulnerable and can be completely wiped out very quickly, as millions have been, not to mention the millions that are in negative equity.

andyh wrote:
Exactly, and the mentality of a solid middle class is gone, and the income is relative as you mention, plus the ability of a individual or family to feel secure about their maintaining a financial level of security is also gone.

anybody who served as a non commissioned officer in the armed forces is definably not middle class that's for sure.

Any scrote bag who has made money out of the property boom since the 80's but was skint before isn't middle class.

It's easier to say who isn't middle class.

I do love working class who think they are middle class though,its a hoot.

Middle class is where landed gentry have been watered down by scum class

The class system/cast system is horse shit and designed by a psychopath i must add.

wake_up_bomb wrote:
I own my property, but I wouldn't describe myself as middle class. Hardly anyone knows that we own our property and to look at we would appear to be rather common and working class.

LesleyPumpshaft wrote: I did think that you might not particularly like that definition!

Note that I said to be middle-class you have to own your own property. It doesn't necessarily follow that if you do then you are middle-class, just that you can't be if you don't. Lots of people who definitely would consider themselves middle-class, and who have pretty big incomes, owe banks hundreds of thousands of pounds, and can be wiped out very easily because of this. I would much rather have a house or even a flat that I owned outright and a tiny income, than a huge salary and a vast mortgage.

Also, this particularly applies to Britain where the housing market is utterly ridiculous.

wake_up_bomb wrote:
Well, this was my thinking too. There's nothing wrong with being middle class though.

The housing market does take the piss here, and being in any debt leaves you vulnerable imo. I do think there's more to being middle class than just money. Education, occupation and cultural values (if that makes sense) all play a part. You can have a working class family with more money than a middle class family.

The class system...a uniquely British (English?) disease...arrrgh.