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TOPIC: Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says

Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 12 Apr 2013 22:25 #401

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mikey mikey wrote:
I hope that jesus wins. My rancour does not go so far as Hell.

I hope and I ave prayed that she is saved.

Any soul that repents should be saved.

Then there is purgatory. Which is the pain of knowing just why and wha you have done. Xmas Caorl by Dickens is a perfect example/ It is the balance of Mercy and Justice.


And as a Catholic I pray to support souls in that hour of terrible realisation.

IIt is complicated and Dan Brown is dick
I wouldn't profess to be an expert on repenting, but as far as I can see Thatcher went to her grave believing she was 100% right in everything she did. I don't think she repented anything.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 12 Apr 2013 23:20 #402

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Controversy!
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 12 Apr 2013 23:21 #403

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An interesting turn ;)

We all fuck up. We are all fallible. We all have a survival instinct unless stripped of it by events and scars.

Imho, it's how you respond to your own human failings that indicates 'how your doing' so to speak. Realise your mistakes and 'repent' them and god or no god, you're getting closer to the truth. Tiz good for the soul :)

Thatcher has gone to her grave 'unrepentent' for the 'sins' she committed against not only the people of Britain and this planet but for the 'sins' she committed against important cornerstones like honesty, decency and fair play. The brits have always held these cornerstones as tenets of our culture. She has committed high treason against those aspects of 'Britishness'.

She died lonely and largely unloved as a consequence of her choices and her lack of 'awakening'. That for me is poetic justice.
I raise a wry smile at it. That is one of my own failings perhaps. I see no cause for celebration as I've already said. For me that is a distraction and an illusory and ineffectual outpouring of long held negative feelings for this woman. Far better to use the shit of her life as compost for something new to grow. Something we ourselves decide for ourselves rather than have imposed on us by our own human failings and the 'legacy' of this 'unrepentent sinner'. We are 'the meek'...we SHALL inherit the earth.


psst....a little bird told me Jesus was an anarchist ;)
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 00:14 #404

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I will pick number 6 on the list.

By selling off industries such as British Telecom,British Airways, Rolls-Royce and British Airports Authority,British Aerospace,Brit oil,British gas to name but a few it was impossible for the country to go into debt.

It was false economics IMO,short term thinking for the nation and just helped Thatchers mega rich friends.
naivety attracts evil and evil attracts naivety
Last Edit: 13 Apr 2013 11:01 by humanspirit.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 00:43 #405

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She was also unrepentant about covering for and facilitating PAEDOPHILE MURDERERS.

Her biggest sin of all. Let's not forget that one.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 03:00 #406

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wake_up_bomb wrote:
I wouldn't profess to be an expert on repenting, but as far as I can see Thatcher went to her grave believing she was 100% right in everything she did. I don't think she repented anything.

You are one of the most inteeligent, open and sincere minds I have ever encountered in my 41 years. Verry fair is how I would sum you up.

Within Xtiians who are serious about the theology: we can NEVER truly speculate the destination of a soul and we should ALWAYS hope that a soul is saved. I pray a rosary every day and a Chaplet of Divine Mercy. That means that dozens of times I sincerely pray and wish that "that all should go to Heaven, especially this in need of His mercy". Chritians of the original word do not codemn because we are so aware o our own wickedness. Not just our nice side.
Maybe I am brain-washing myself. But I am brain-washing myself to forgive agaianst the constant psycopathic nature of our current society that sends messages every minute that I must be vindictive, selfish and cruel.

she does not deserve Paradise but, quite honnestly, neither do I. So we pray for a salvation.

Odd I know but it keeps me going. And it mkes my heart grow fond and keeeps my ego in check.

You're a clever lad WUB and I am very lucky to have stumbled upon you in this vast net
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Last Edit: 13 Apr 2013 03:14 by mikey mikey.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 03:03 #407

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knobmeup wrote:
An interesting turn ;)

We all fuck up. We are all fallible. We all have a survival instinct unless stripped of it by events and scars.

Imho, it's how you respond to your own human failings that indicates 'how your doing' so to speak. Realise your mistakes and 'repent' them and god or no god, you're getting closer to the truth. Tiz good for the soul :)

Thatcher has gone to her grave 'unrepentent' for the 'sins' she committed against not only the people of Britain and this planet but for the 'sins' she committed against important cornerstones like honesty, decency and fair play. The brits have always held these cornerstones as tenets of our culture. She has committed high treason against those aspects of 'Britishness'.

She died lonely and largely unloved as a consequence of her choices and her lack of 'awakening'. That for me is poetic justice.
I raise a wry smile at it. That is one of my own failings perhaps. I see no cause for celebration as I've already said. For me that is a distraction and an illusory and ineffectual outpouring of long held negative feelings for this woman. Far better to use the shit of her life as compost for something new to grow. Something we ourselves decide for ourselves rather than have imposed on us by our own human failings and the 'legacy' of this 'unrepentent sinner'. We are 'the meek'...we SHALL inherit the earth.


psst....a little bird told me Jesus was an anarchist ;)

You have done what I could not. You escaped bitterness.

Better Xtian than I. I am humbled by your post.

thank you St Jude for favours granted
Last Edit: 13 Apr 2013 03:05 by mikey mikey.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 03:32 #408

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Sorry folks for the preachy tangent. Normal servive will be reumed :emb:
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 04:19 #409

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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 10:44 #410

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mikey mikey wrote:
You are one of the most inteeligent, open and sincere minds I have ever encountered in my 41 years. Verry fair is how I would sum you up.

Within Xtiians who are serious about the theology: we can NEVER truly speculate the destination of a soul and we should ALWAYS hope that a soul is saved. I pray a rosary every day and a Chaplet of Divine Mercy. That means that dozens of times I sincerely pray and wish that "that all should go to Heaven, especially this in need of His mercy". Chritians of the original word do not codemn because we are so aware o our own wickedness. Not just our nice side.
Maybe I am brain-washing myself. But I am brain-washing myself to forgive agaianst the constant psycopathic nature of our current society that sends messages every minute that I must be vindictive, selfish and cruel.

she does not deserve Paradise but, quite honnestly, neither do I. So we pray for a salvation.

Odd I know but it keeps me going. And it mkes my heart grow fond and keeeps my ego in check.

You're a clever lad WUB and I am very lucky to have stumbled upon you in this vast net
Thank you, that's really very humbling!

I must say that I can't bring myself to feel any glee about Thatcher's death. I absolutely understand why others feel that way, and I feel the same way they do about the Thatcher government, but I sort of feel the same way as you about it, but for different reasons. I do believe that people can achieve salvation, but for me they have to show that in this earthly realm. I'm not sure about the afterlife and all that, I don't even have any beliefs, I'm just waiting to see what happens!

Just for me, in this life, she showed no remorse, no repentance, and actually all the people that supported her still do so, even if they've actually been adversely affected by the policies of her government! One of the most important and fascinating things about her, in my opinion, is that despite the fact she was completely reviled by huge swathes of the population, she never lost an election. In fact, you could say that the two most reviled British political figures of the last thirty years, Thatcher and Blair, won six general elections between them and lost zero. I think this says something quite interesting about the extent to which people are vulnerable to being drawn to these superficially charismatic, sociopathic people.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 11:03 #411

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mikey mikey wrote:
I hope that jesus wins. My rancour does not go so far as Hell.

I hope and I ave prayed that she is saved.

Any soul that repents should be saved.

Then there is purgatory. Which is the pain of knowing just why and wha you have done

I personally never liked the Gospel of John, I much preferred the simplicity of the other 3 chaps to the 'arrogance' of John.
For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. Matthew 7:2
“Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye? “You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye. Matthew 7:3-5

and finally...
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God and keep His commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil." King Solomon Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

Thank you for the film....I am going to watch that later today when the rain comes in.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 11:05 #412

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5. Which laws brought in by the EU actually have affected you,the only laws that have impacted on me are the ones from parliament,those people are worse than the EU.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 11:08 #413

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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 11:47 #414

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BBC defends Baroness Thatcher Ding Dong song decision

Ben Cooper says the decision is a "compromise" but not a "fudge"
Continue reading the main story
Baroness Thatcher 1925-2013

MPs and peers' tributes
Obituary
How will history remember Thatcher?
What is Thatcherism?

The BBC has defended its decision not to play in full on Radio 1's Official Chart Show a song at the centre of an anti-Baroness Thatcher campaign.

A five second clip of Ding Dong! The Witch is Dead will be played in a news item on Sunday's show.

BBC Radio 1 controller Ben Cooper said the move over the Wizard of Oz film track had been a difficult compromise.

He said he had to balance respect for someone who had just died with issues around freedom of speech.

Sales of the song, from the 1939 musical starring Judy Garland, have soared since former Prime Minister Lady Thatcher's death on Monday, aged 87.
'Grieving family'

Speaking to BBC News, Mr Cooper said: "You have a track which I believe is disrespectful. It is not a political track, it is a personal attack on an individual who has just died.

"But on the other hand, if I ban the track then you have arguments about censorship and freedom of speech.

"I also took into account the very difficult scenario of the fact there's a grieving family involved here who have yet to bury a loved one.

"So those sort of elements were in my thinking to come up with this decision that I would play not the track in full, but a clip of the track within a journalistic environment."

The single is set to take the number three spot in Sunday's countdown, according to the Official Charts Company.

Meanwhile, a serving police officer who posted offensive messages on Twitter following Lady Thatcher's death has resigned.

Sgt Jeremy Scott, of the Metropolitan Police, is reported to have written that he hoped her death was "painful and degrading".

Scotland Yard said Sgt Scott's resignation was accepted with immediate effect.

The Met's Commander Allan Gibson added: "This officer's behaviour was completely unacceptable and it is right that he has resigned."
'Distasteful and inappropriate'

In his BBC blog, Mr Cooper explained that - as controller of Radio 1 - there were times when "you find yourself caught between a rock and a hard place".

And the corporation released a statement, saying: "The BBC finds this campaign distasteful, but does not believe the record should be banned.
Continue reading the main story
Wizard of Oz lobby card and Margaret Thatcher

R1 won't play full Thatcher row song
Thatcher 'death tweet' officer quits
More Thatcher funeral guests named
Thatcher party Hillsborough plea

"On Sunday, the Radio 1 Chart Show will contain a news item explaining why the song is in the charts, during which a short clip will be played, as it has been in some of our news programmes."

BBC director general Tony Hall said: "I understand the concerns about this campaign. I personally believe it is distasteful and inappropriate.

"However, I do believe it would be wrong to ban the song outright as free speech is an important principle and a ban would only give it more publicity."

The original song was performed in the Wizard of Oz by characters celebrating the demise of a much-hated witch.

Rival campaigns are under way to get a song considered to be more favourable to Lady Thatcher into this week's countdown as well.

Capital FM, which has its own chart show, said the station was currently "reviewing the situation".
'Political hijack'

The Conservative chairman of the Commons culture, media and sport select committee, John Whittingdale, said the BBC's decision was a sensible compromise.

Jarvis Cocker: ''It's a free speech issue''

"I don't think it would have been right to have allowed the Chart Show to have been hijacked for political purposes and had they played the whole song, that would have been the consequence," he said.

"But on the other hand, they couldn't have just ignored the fact that it does feature amongst the most downloaded singles of the week."

However, the Conservative MP for Reading East, Rob Wilson, said the track should be played in its entirety.

He said: "I think that Margaret Thatcher would be horrified having helped free millions of people in eastern Europe and been the symbol of freedom around the world that she could in any way have censorship in her own country.

"The BBC has had a very difficult decision and it's come up with a very British old-fashioned fudge."

Singer Jarvis Cocker told the BBC that Lady Thatcher may not have minded the controversy.

Mr Cocker, who has a show on BBC Radio 6 Music, said: "This is a premier who seemed to thrive on conflict and stuff like that. You can't have somebody who's so divisive in the country pass away and there be no negative reaction to it."

DJ Paul Gambaccini said Sunday's show had become "part of the BBC history of censorship".
Funeral preparations

In another development, Hillsborough campaigner Margaret Aspinall urged people attending a party to mark Lady Thatcher's death not to celebrate in the name of the 96 football supporters who died in 1989.

Hundreds of people are expected to attend the party outside St George's Hall in Liverpool on Wednesday.

Two Conservative MPs have called for one of Britain's main airports to be renamed Margaret Thatcher International.

Stephen Metcalfe and Eleanor Laing put down an early day motion, saying it would recognise her "colossal achievements".

Preparations are continuing for Lady Thatcher's funeral at St Paul's Cathedral in London on Wednesday.

Downing Street released the names of more guests who will attend, including US politician Newt Gingrich and former Australian Prime Minister John Howard.

Advertising magnate Lord Maurice Saatchi, web pioneer Sir Tim Berners-Lee and singer Katherine Jenkins have also accepted invitations.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22126940
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 12:03 #415

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Former miners who say Margaret Thatcher decimated their communities will be joining socialists, travellers, students and anti-capitalist protesters at a demonstration against her legacy in Trafalgar Square on Saturday.

A delegation of ex-miners from Durham is due to attend the protest with the north-east area banner and others are expected to travel from former mining heartlands in Yorkshire and Wales.

The event, due to start at 6pm, being promoted through various Facebook groups, has gathered momentum this week as the row over Thatcher's legacy has turned increasingly sour.

Tensions were ratcheted up on Friday when mayor of London Boris Johnson said police were prepared for outbreaks of disorder. Speaking to LBC Radio, Johnson said: "We live in a democracy where people are entitled to protest, where they are entitled to have fun and do what they want."

However, the mayor became the first senior figure to raise the possibility of violence when he added: "What they can't do is, I think, use the death of an elderly person to begin riot or affray or that sort of thing. So we're getting ready for all that. The police are obviously going to be making sure that if people do break the law they will be properly dealt with."

For police the rhetoric around Saturday's protests and speculation about trouble at those events and at the funeral of Baroness Thatcher are some of the factors they are considering as they assess the scale of challenges they face.

Police are privately confident that their ability to analyse social media postings has improved since the riots of 2011 but there remains a nervousness about how peacefully the events will pass off.

Hundreds of officers will be kept "kitted up" and ready to be deployed rapidly at any flashpoints amid a determination among police chiefs that control of the streets will not be lost as in the 2011 riots or the attack on Millbank towers in November 2010, during student protests. Met bosses know a sustained loss of control of the streets would be damaging and lead to criticism, as will allegations of over-reaction against people peacefully protesting the Thatcher legacy.

There are no official organisers of Saturday's protest, which is the result of a historical quirk. Two decades ago, the anarchist collective Class War said there should be a gathering at Trafalgar square at 6pm on the first Saturday after Thatcher's death. In 1994, stickers and posters were printed promoting the event, which was then presumed a distant prospect.

Class War has long since disappeared, but the date appears to have stuck. Ian Bone, Class War's most famous former campaigner, admitted he was suprised at the attention he was getting, including invitations to appear on morning television programmes. "As one of the few Class Warriors still about, I thought it was my duty to speak up on behalf of the event," he said. Media outlets have been mentioning the details of Saturday's scheduled protest all week. "It's been brilliant," said Bone, who estimates up to 2,000 may attend.

David Hopper, general secretary of the Durham Miners' Association, said miners from the north-east would be among the protesters. "There are some ex-miners coming down for the protest in Trafalgar Square and they are taking one of our banners down – the north-east area banner. They are trying to get a Yorkshire banner to go down too so I think there will be quite a few down there."

He said there was a still a great deal of anger over the impact of Thatcher's policies in former coal mining communities: "She destroyed our communities, she destroyed our villages, she has destroyed our pits and she tried to destroy our dignity … Her reign was a disaster for the mining communities."

Tony Smith, who woked as a miner in a Nottinghamshire pit before it was closed in 1989, said he understood the argument that it was inappropriate to celebrate an elderly person's death. "But the strength of ill-feeling is so deep it overrides any reservations," he said. "We've lived under Thatcher's shadow for many years. It split families right down the middle and that resentment is still going on."

John Mulrenan, 58, who was an active trade unionist during the 1980s said he would be joining lots of his former colleagues and comrades in Trafalgar Square on Saturday night. "We made that pledge 25 years ago that when Thatcher was no longer we would get together and we have been in touch to arrange it. We are not talking class war here, we are talking about normal, concerned, politically active people who remember the devastating impact of those years on working people."

Marc Vallee, a photographer who has documented protests in the UK for over a decade, said. "The fact broadcasters like Sky News have been announcing there will be protests at 6pm on Saturday is huge. You can't buy that kind of publicity.

You can never predict turnout at protests, but from the people I've been talking to, I'd say we're looking at thousands - and that includes types you might say are more combative."

In addition to London-based activists, the Guardian has spoken to peoplpe attending from Brighton, Bristol, Cardiff, Leeds, Doncaster and Norwich. They include students in their 20s, staunch leftwingers and radical anarchists. Among them are likely to be students who participated in the 2010 demonstrations that brought London to standstill, most were children during Thatcher's reign and some had not even been born.

Michael Segalov, a Sussex University student activist, said groups from Goldsmiths College, University College London and Kings College were attending the demonstration.

A middle-aged anarchist attending from Norwich said: "Anyone I used to knock around with when I was young, living as a traveller, would be tempted to go down. We just hated her so much: her policies, everything she stood for. People say that protesting her legacy is offensive. I am so bloody offended to see the state put this woman on a pedestal."

Facebook sites have been set up to organise parties celebrating the former prime minister's death. One group, Maggie's Good Riddance Party, claims it will hold a "right jolly knees-up" outside St Paul's Cathedral on the day of the funeral and calls on people to turn their back on the procession as it passes by.

However, there is agreement among most far-left and anti-capitalist campaigners that Saturday will be the main day for protest; few appear to have genuine plans to disrupt the funeral, which takes place at 11am on Wednesday and will be heavily policed.

Val Swain, spokesperson for Netpol, a police monitoring group, said: "The Saturday protest is certainly an event that people are traveling to. I know personally of at least two or three carloads going down from south Wales, but there could be more."

She added: "I have a feeling that police will want people to demonstrate on Saturday, rather than the funeral. They're used to dealing with large public order events in Trafalgar Square – big protests and New Year's Eve celebrations. The view among a lot of activists is that if they even turn up at the funeral on Wednesday, they're likely to get arrested. That's discouraging people from even talking about it."
www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/apr/12/...ts-weekend-thousands
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 12:13 #416

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I lived the thatcher years and it was grim for poor people, I couldn't give a fuck if she is dead, what fucks me off the most is the state sponsored denial of how many peole feel about her and what she represented.

She decimated anything anti establishment with war like ferocity, the miners, the print, football fans, ravers and travellers and that's just stuff I had personal involvement in, we need a new class war!

Fuck Thactcher, and don't worry Tony you cunt, people will rejoice just as much when you snuff it!
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 12:37 #417

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dantesrevival wrote:
I lived the thatcher years and it was grim for poor people, I couldn't give a fuck if she is dead, what fucks me off the most is the state sponsored denial of how many peole feel about her and what she represented.

She decimated anything anti establishment with war like ferocity, the miners, the print, football fans, ravers and travellers and that's just stuff I had personal involvement in, we need a new class war!

Fuck Thactcher, and don't worry Tony you cunt, people will rejoice just as much when you snuff it!

Too fucking right.

What's really getting on my tits is all this Ooooh it's distasteful to celebrate from the likes of Cameron - while these people explicitly make attempts to gain political capital out of her death by rewriting history to say she saved the universe. Personally I think an honest celebration the bitch is dead is far less distasteful than a cynical effort to propagandise about the glories of neo-liberalism.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 12:55 #418

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humanspirit wrote:
@space bandit

5. Which laws brought in by the EU actually have affected you,the only laws that have impacted on me are the ones from parliament,those people are worse than the EU.

You're not... you're not... you're not suggesting that was my POV were you?
:D
Whatever feeble lists people attribute to her doing anything good, which isn't much and could easily be countered, won't match oioioi's list of 46 things that make her a cunt!
Didn't she say 'rejoice, rejoice' after sinking the Belgrano as it was sailing away from the exclusion zone after they altered the rules of engagement ?
That's pretty sick.
Set the controls for the heart of the earth.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 13:42 #419

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The BBC has defended its decision not to play in full on Radio 1's Official Chart Show a song at the centre of an anti-Baroness Thatcher campaign.
- Okay, snivelling peasants, you can fund this woman's funeral whether you like it or not.
- Can we express our opinion on the subject?
- No.
- Do we still have to fund the BBC?
- Yes.
- Okay, well that seems fair.
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
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Baroness Thatcher has died following a stroke, her spokesman Lord Bell says 13 Apr 2013 13:49 #420

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Space Bandit wrote:
humanspirit wrote:
@space bandit

5. Which laws brought in by the EU actually have affected you,the only laws that have impacted on me are the ones from parliament,those people are worse than the EU.

You're not... you're not... you're not suggesting that was my POV were you?
:D
Whatever feeble lists people attribute to her doing anything good, which isn't much and could easily be countered, won't match oioioi's list of 46 things that make her a cunt!
Didn't she say 'rejoice, rejoice' after sinking the Belgrano as it was sailing away from the exclusion zone after they altered the rules of engagement ?
That's pretty sick.

It's actually Mike Harding's list with a few additions....actually, come to think of it, it's Thatcher's list/legacy!
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