Space Bandit wrote:
Created by the greed of sociopaths. Yes. Can you see it yet?

I would prefer a sensible discussion rather than videos.

“If one wanted to crush and destroy a man entirely, to mete out to him the most terrible punishment,” wrote Dostoevsky, “all one would have to do would be to make him do work that was completely and utterly devoid of usefulness and meaning.”

That is all

SilvaRizla wrote:
I mentioned earlier on in the thread about babies in the womb. Stress levels during pregnancy send levels of cortisol to the unborn communicating what sort of environment it will be born into. Post war tests in Holland prove that women who went without food & lived in poor conditions had children that grew up to become greedy and selfish and considerably more likely to turn to crime compared to the children of pregnant women who had a reasonable standard of living.
Money has always and always will create inequality therefore this cycle is perpetual, having spiralled the amount of sociopaths in sociey in to all areas of social stratification. . The monetary paradigm is totally arse about tit by rewarding people the most for doing the most horrific things, whilst the people who actually make a society tick & do the dirty jobs get shafted. It is multi-faceted structural abuse.
Can you see it yet?

Space Bandit wrote:
We are indeed creatures of nurture not nature. We adapt to our environment.

22 pages of pure BS....thank fuck I only read a few

entrangermercenary1 wrote:
You've filled a fair few in your time.
& only you have read all of them.

SilvaRizla wrote:
I mentioned earlier on in the thread about babies in the womb. Stress levels during pregnancy send levels of cortisol to the unborn communicating what sort of environment it will be born into. Post war tests in Holland prove that women who went without food & lived in poor conditions had children that grew up to become greedy and selfish and considerably more likely to turn to crime compared to the children of pregnant women who had a reasonable standard of living.
Money has always and always will create inequality therefore this cycle is perpetual, having spiralled the amount of sociopaths in sociey in to all areas of social stratification. . The monetary paradigm is totally arse about tit by rewarding people the most for doing the most horrific things, whilst the people who actually make a society tick & do the dirty jobs get shafted. It is multi-faceted structural abuse.
Can you see it yet?

entrangermercenary1 wrote:
You've filled a fair few in your time.
& only you have read all of them.

You're improving a bit with a hint that it might include some violence but still no specifics as yet

As for Iceland, NO they did NOT address 'the problem' because they still have a central bank, borrow at interest and they still take part in the global FR system.

They arrested a couple of bankers but not shareholders or controlling interests in foreign central banks and they appointed a new parliament which is slightly improved but with the same potential for corruption as before.

Had they printed their own debt free treasury notes then I might have sat up and taken some notice but theres just some red lines the paradigm will not cross.

Mondragon also does not address FR banking directly, more indirectly as per Barnfish's idea of using co-op banks, ofc Mondragon goes a whole 1000 yards further than merely banks and really makes some positive impact but its still not enough, as of and in itself it will not stop the elite from pwning the planet and that really should be the common goal of everyone here and our raison d'etre.

We can muck around with our money all we like, its a piss in the pond, they will laugh at your pathetic puny attempts.
Its that which I'm trying to get across, how truly powerless you are if this is the best we can come up with.

The issues are systemic and connected at core to the monetary system, unless we address that in a fruitful manner then we are wasting time here.

Barnfish wrote:
Thats up to the people involved in whatever system they choose.
I'm not the NaN type so I'm not the perfect benevolent dictator

NB: I should add that FR needn't exist at all as part of the monetary system. Banks needn't be anything like as major an aspect as they are today. Only loaning occasionally for business purposes with self risk. If that happened prices would plummet as credit would not be available generally. Wages would not need to keep pace with inflation because there would be no inflation.
Again such an economy is difficult to bring about and maintain within any single nation unless its quite self reliant and not corrupt and so on and so forth. We have had it in the past and it worked just fine, the example is ofc the wild west but back then homesteads are what kept that working.
Today you cannot walk out into the countryside and build your own house, the land is owned. There might be some countries where it is still allowed somewhere, personally I don't know of any offhand. Given the amount of empty wild land it 'ought' to be something forced upon the landowners but again thats not going to happen either.

@ silva.
You contend that it has been clearly shown that money is necessary and seem to build a lot of your argument on that premise.

Yet, it hasn't been shown at all.
In fact even my meagre contribution to this thread shows it isn't necessary. No resource disappears as a result of the removal of money...

What your suggestion is, is to tinker with the stablished system. Short term, i am all for that.
As a means to moving far further. Growing out of ridiculous concepts like money is something we will hqve to do at some point if we are to survive and prosper as a species.

SilvaRizla wrote:
I mentioned earlier on in the thread about babies in the womb. Stress levels during pregnancy send levels of cortisol to the unborn communicating what sort of environment it will be born into. Post war tests in Holland prove that women who went without food & lived in poor conditions had children that grew up to become greedy and selfish and considerably more likely to turn to crime compared to the children of pregnant women who had a reasonable standard of living.
Money has always and always will create inequality therefore this cycle is perpetual, having spiralled the amount of sociopaths in sociey in to all areas of social stratification. . The monetary paradigm is totally arse about tit by rewarding people the most for doing the most horrific things, whilst the people who actually make a society tick & do the dirty jobs get shafted. It is multi-faceted structural abuse.
Can you see it yet?

Space Bandit wrote:
We are indeed creatures of nurture not nature. We adapt to our environment.

I AM ALL I AM wrote:
I would prefer a sensible discussion rather than videos. A slave has no freedom whatsoever. The rest of us have degrees of freedom and the supposed wage slave in the western world has significant freedom. A child worker in Asia making footballs day in day out has far less freedom and is closer to slavery than I am. What about the self employed who pay themselves? Or do you think everyone earning a wage is a wage slave?

What statements about poverty? You have now launched into a completely different set of topics from anything I have talked about so far.